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In most regions R-U106 is between 18-26 with Wuerttemberg West (18), Franconia (19), North Baden (18), Wuerttemberg West-Baden South (19), Switzerland (23), Saarland-Palatinate (20), Bavaria (24) , Hesse South (21), West Prussia (21), Eifel (26) significantly higher only in Lower Saxony (29), and significantly lower only in the East, like East Prussia (13), East Pommerania (7). Lower medium values for Silesia (16), Alsatia-South Baden (15).
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(11-12-2023, 06:40 PM)Mitchell-Atkins Wrote: (11-12-2023, 04:31 PM)Riverman Wrote: Since I was asked about G and R-U152, here some short notes about what we can see in the pies:
Going by the pies he posted, G is highest in Southern Germany with about 9 %, rest is more intermediate (about 4-6) and the NW (4). Lowest in the East (2-3). Non-U106 R1b makes up more than a quarter in the South. Therefore I would associate both with Celts, obviously.
The peak for G is in Baden-Wuerttemberg and Switzerland, like expected. Most interesting: In Baden and Alsace G exceeds R-U152, whereas in most other areas its the opposite. Baden and Alsace are therefore peak regions for G, just like Eifel and Franconia are peak regions for E-V13. The latter is all the more astonishing, as these are for the Centre-South two separated regions. However, Hessen is in the middle and has a high percentage too, which kind of creates a belt for E-V13 from Eifel to Franconia. The G hotspot is more compact by comparison (Alsace-German Swiss, basically Allemannic speakers).
EDIT: Nevermind
I guess your data base was larger and different, probably it would be interesting to compare the results from these different sources. I'm sure that even if doing the same for the current members of the German FTDNA project, the results would be a bit different, since a lot of new testers came in and for some regions the number of testers was really pretty low.
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11-12-2023, 08:46 PM
(This post was last modified: 11-12-2023, 09:02 PM by Mitchell-Atkins.)
(11-12-2023, 07:52 PM)Riverman Wrote: (11-12-2023, 06:40 PM)Mitchell-Atkins Wrote: (11-12-2023, 04:31 PM)Riverman Wrote: Since I was asked about G and R-U152, here some short notes about what we can see in the pies:
Going by the pies he posted, G is highest in Southern Germany with about 9 %, rest is more intermediate (about 4-6) and the NW (4). Lowest in the East (2-3). Non-U106 R1b makes up more than a quarter in the South. Therefore I would associate both with Celts, obviously.
The peak for G is in Baden-Wuerttemberg and Switzerland, like expected. Most interesting: In Baden and Alsace G exceeds R-U152, whereas in most other areas its the opposite. Baden and Alsace are therefore peak regions for G, just like Eifel and Franconia are peak regions for E-V13. The latter is all the more astonishing, as these are for the Centre-South two separated regions. However, Hessen is in the middle and has a high percentage too, which kind of creates a belt for E-V13 from Eifel to Franconia. The G hotspot is more compact by comparison (Alsace-German Swiss, basically Allemannic speakers).
EDIT: Nevermind
I guess your data base was larger and different, probably it would be interesting to compare the results from these different sources. I'm sure that even if doing the same for the current members of the German FTDNA project, the results would be a bit different, since a lot of new testers came in and for some regions the number of testers was really pretty low.
I "neverminded" because I got access to the FB data I was asking you about.
I'm just using FTDNA's haplotree data
For those interested,
FB Switzerland = 14%, FTDNA hapolotree = 15.72%
FB 1870 Germany = 9%, FTDNA haplotree = 6.2%
For those interested in U152 data, FB has U152 highest in Wurttemberg West at 21% and lowest in East Frisia/Bremen at 0%.
I will provide a more detailed analysis and U152 map update later.
U152>L2>Z49>Z142>Z150>FGC12381>FGC12378>FGC47869>FGC12401>FGC47875>FGC12384
50% English, 15% Welsh, 15% Scot/Ulster Scot, 5% Irish, 10% German, 2% Fennoscandian 2% French/Dutch, 1% India
Ancient ~40% Anglo-Saxon, ~40% Briton/Insular Celt, ~15% German, 4% Other Euro
600 AD: 55% Anglo-Saxon (CNE), 45% Pre-Anglo-Saxon Briton (WBI)
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(11-12-2023, 07:50 PM)Riverman Wrote: In most regions R-U106 is between 18-26 with Wuerttemberg West (18), Franconia (19), North Baden (18), Wuerttemberg West-Baden South (19), Switzerland (23), Saarland-Palatinate (20), Bavaria (24) , Hesse South (21), West Prussia (21), Eifel (26) significantly higher only in Lower Saxony (29), and significantly lower only in the East, like East Prussia (13), East Pommerania (7). Lower medium values for Silesia (16), Alsatia-South Baden (15).
I'm surprised it's so high in West Prussia, unless I'm thinking of something different.
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11-13-2023, 02:34 AM
(This post was last modified: 11-13-2023, 02:46 AM by Mitchell-Atkins.)
(11-12-2023, 08:46 PM)Mitchell-Atkins Wrote: I will provide a more detailed analysis ...later.
U152
Wurttemberg West: 21%
Tyrol/Salzburg: 20%
Wurttemberg West-Baden South: 19%
Saarland-Palatinate: 17%
Switzerland: 14%
Eifel: 12%
Bavaria: 11%
Silesia: 9%
Hesse South: 8%
Alsatia-South Baden: 8%
North Baden: 7%
Lower Saxony: 4%
Franconia: 3%
East Prussia: 3%
West Prussia: 2%
East Pomerania: 2%
East Frisia/Bremen: 0%
DF27
Wurttemberg West: 12%
Wurttemberg West-Baden South: 11%
East Pomerania: 10%
North Baden: 9%
Saarland-Palatinate: 7%
Eifel: 7%
Hesse South: 7%
Franconia: 6%
East Prussia: 6%
Switzerland: 5%
West Prussia: 5%
East Frisia/Bremen: 5%
Silesia: 3%
Alsatia-South Baden: 3%
Lower Saxony: 3%
Bavaria: 2%
Tyrol/Salzburg: 0%
L21
Alsatia-South Baden: 15%
East Pommerania: 10%
Lower Saxony: 7%
Wurttemberg West: 6%
Wurttemberg West-Baden South: 6%
Franconia: 6%
Saarland-Palatinate: 5%
Hesse South: 5%
East Frisia/Bremen: 5%
North Baden: 4%
Silesia: 3%
Eifel: 2%
Switzerland: 2%
West Prussia: 2%
Bavaria: 2%
East Prussia: 0%
Tyrol/Salzburg: 0%
-------------- U152 DF27 L21
NW Germany 7% 3% 4%
E. Germany 5% 5% 4%
S. Germany 12% 6% 7%
U152>L2>Z49>Z142>Z150>FGC12381>FGC12378>FGC47869>FGC12401>FGC47875>FGC12384
50% English, 15% Welsh, 15% Scot/Ulster Scot, 5% Irish, 10% German, 2% Fennoscandian 2% French/Dutch, 1% India
Ancient ~40% Anglo-Saxon, ~40% Briton/Insular Celt, ~15% German, 4% Other Euro
600 AD: 55% Anglo-Saxon (CNE), 45% Pre-Anglo-Saxon Briton (WBI)
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11-13-2023, 09:56 AM
(This post was last modified: 11-13-2023, 10:15 AM by Riverman.)
(11-12-2023, 11:03 PM)NewEnglander Wrote: (11-12-2023, 07:50 PM)Riverman Wrote: In most regions R-U106 is between 18-26 with Wuerttemberg West (18), Franconia (19), North Baden (18), Wuerttemberg West-Baden South (19), Switzerland (23), Saarland-Palatinate (20), Bavaria (24) , Hesse South (21), West Prussia (21), Eifel (26) significantly higher only in Lower Saxony (29), and significantly lower only in the East, like East Prussia (13), East Pommerania (7). Lower medium values for Silesia (16), Alsatia-South Baden (15).
I'm surprised it's so high in West Prussia, unless I'm thinking of something different.
Keep in mind that the FTDNA group members from West Prussia were Germans and a large fraction of Germans from West Prussia were recent immigrants from Western Germany, similar to say many other Polish, Russian, Ukrainian and Moldovan German colonies. I know that for sure since my close relatives and I have many matches from West Prussia with the majority having roots in Rhineland-Palatinate, Hesse and Baden-Wuerttemberg. Therefore you have in West Prussia more local and Eastern Germans, Western German colonists and a local Polish population, of which the majority won't be in the German FTDNA group.
Because of that the German speakers of the region around 1870 were both by uniparentals and autosomally fairly Western or more accurately being a fairly Western German - fairly Eastern European mix, rather then being regular East German.
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https://dnk.poreklo.rs/DNK-projekat/
Serbian DNA project has a decent database.
https://bosniakdna.com/y-dnk-velika-baza/
Bosniaks also, but I don't know if all of them are Bosniaks, probably not. It will need a lot of filtering.
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(11-12-2023, 07:50 PM)Riverman Wrote: In most regions R-U106 is between 18-26 with Wuerttemberg West (18), Franconia (19), North Baden (18), Wuerttemberg West-Baden South (19), Switzerland (23), Saarland-Palatinate (20), Bavaria (24) , Hesse South (21), West Prussia (21), Eifel (26) significantly higher only in Lower Saxony (29), and significantly lower only in the East, like East Prussia (13), East Pommerania (7). Lower medium values for Silesia (16), Alsatia-South Baden (15).
I wish we could find out if the DF19 roughly peaks in the same regions as U106. But I think we got grouped into "Other P312" and I'm not sure if even that has region detail.
R1b>M269>L23>L51>L11>P312>DF19>DF88>FGC11833 >S4281>S4268>Z17112>FT354149
Ancestors: Francis Cooke (M223/I2a2a) b1583; Hester Mahieu (Cooke) (J1c2 mtDNA) b.1584; Richard Warren (E-M35) b1578; Elizabeth Walker (Warren) (H1j mtDNA) b1583; John Mead (I2a1/P37.2) b1634; Rev. Joseph Hull (I1, L1301+ L1302-) b1595; Benjamin Harrington (M223/I2a2a-Y5729) b1618; Joshua Griffith (L21>DF13) b1593; John Wing (U106>Z8>Z1) b1584; John Howland (U106>Z8>Z1) b1593; Elizabeth Tilley (Howland) (H1a1 mtDNA) b1607; Thomas Gunn (DF19) b1605; Hermann Wilhelm (DF19) b1635
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The same for France... https://twitter.com/rupturengine/status/...8180401574
"It's only for French and mixed French men, the province based on autosomal region matching, which means the data is significantly amplified and generalized."
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12-07-2023, 08:57 AM
(This post was last modified: 12-07-2023, 10:17 AM by lukpl.)
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12-07-2023, 09:00 AM
(This post was last modified: 12-07-2023, 09:01 AM by lukpl.)
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The 23andme leak contained data on 8913 Canadian men who had their province listed.
https://twitter.com/rupturengine/status/...7839981664
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